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bert private msg quote post Address this user
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4f8hPSpKwA&feature=youtu.be

Don is trying to get his part on tape
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RicardoAPriori private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks Bert.

Remember Phil explaining in an interview how he’d first let Don figure out what he was going to do with a new song in the studio while he waited in the control room, and only then start working with Don on the harmony [by the way, if any one remembers where this interview is, please remind me, ‘cause couldn’t find just right now].

Worth comparing with the following versions to see how the arrangement evolved:





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DeeDee private msg quote post Address this user
Fascinating post Bert! Really interesting to hear Don's part separately then the finished article!!
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Jeanroberts private msg quote post Address this user
Thank you Bert! Good to hear two takes in readiness of the final recording! xxx
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Kathyc private msg quote post Address this user
The boys were given this song and told it was exclusively THEIRS and they put their hearts and soul into making it a hit. However the song writers then gave the song to other country artists. Phil was cross upset and furious over this, my memory is a little vague here just remember him being pretty angry perhaps Terry you can come in on this? PLEASE.
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bert private msg quote post Address this user
I remember when my brother and recorded the 4 songs for our EP "Ode to Don & Phil" in early 1982, the studio owner ( a very good friend of ours, who also was a songwriter, producer, the guy wrote arrangements for classical, jazz and pop music. He could tell which instrument, out of the sixty plus present in his studio was out of tune when he was recording a classical piece. I was present and could not believe it when he said ...the second trumpet on row 4 is out of tune ! ) asked me to bring an Everly Brothers LP to our next session. He just wanted to listen how they had recorded in the past. A few days later I showed up with an album, wish I could remember which one it was! We were going through some songs and he looked at me and said: Do you know that the high voice is recorded in another studio ?? I looked at him and was stunned I hardly could believe it. It still is a miracle to me.
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CameronMcMenemy private msg quote post Address this user
This is one of my favorite Everly Brothers songs
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Jeanroberts private msg quote post Address this user
Interesting Bert! I listen to quite a lot of classical music and find it amazing how often in an orchestra a solo flute e.g. is out of tune or the bass is slightly out of tune!

Some people not only have excellent hearing, they have a finely tuned ear for music! As did the chap you are telling us about! My father was like this and I detect the same thing! We can all easily hear cracked notes. However, should we take a hearing test, many of us would come out with hearing defects we knew nothing about!

I remember a incident a long time ago, while in a music group belonging to an active church. Two girls wanted to join as singers. They were asked to sing something of their choice. They decided to sing together a song the rest of us didn't know! Everyone put their instruments down but asked if I could try and follow their song as I was playing a classical guitar and it could be played quietly!

I've never heard TWO more tone deaf people in my life! And we've all heard a few! They finished what they thought they were singing and asked me if I'd got the tune? I'm trying to be kind and explained maybe the melody was a little difficult!

“We'll sing it again!” they told me, and off they went for a second round, even worse this time and no resemblance to the first!....... “Do you have the tune now?” they asked me. I looked around at the others, they were sucking their cheeks and seriously contemplating their feet! “We've sung it twice!” they protested. I was well caught in a trap so I laughed and proclaimed cheerfully “Tell you what! I'll choose one of them!”

Oh! bless ‘em. I honestly didn't know what else to say! Thankfully, I wasn't the leader who took people on!
xxxxx
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ChrisW private msg quote post Address this user
@RicardoAPriori

The first version you posted Ricardo they call it the composite take and I have never known why, usually another take or alternate version. Both version are quite different but I like them both.
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LizzieB private msg quote post Address this user
Thank you Bert. Loved hearing this one again.
Also everyone else for the interesting inputs-Love it.
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Joyb private msg quote post Address this user
Thanhk you Bert and Ricardo. I have always loved this song. Another that should have been a huge hit but wasn’t given enough promotion or airplay. Really upsets me and infuriats me when the radio stations just play the PAUL Young or Nicky Thomas versions they aren’t a patch on Don and Phils. I believe the 4 Preps and Waylon Jennings also recorded it xx❤️❤️
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Marion private msg quote post Address this user
Thank you Bert and Ricardo. A great Everly song, and a big favorite with my husband along with Bowling Green, which come up one after another on a cd I bought him for his car. Almost always get a repeat play.
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Jeanroberts private msg quote post Address this user
Thank you Bert and Ricardo! Always very good to hear rehearsals and the build up to a finished music product! I know we all appreciate your posts! xxxxx
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RicardoAPriori private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by bert
I remember when my brother and recorded the 4 songs for our EP "Ode to Don & Phil" in early 1982, the studio owner ( a very good friend of ours, who also was a songwriter, producer, the guy wrote arrangements for classical, jazz and pop music. He could tell which instrument, out of the sixty plus present in his studio was out of tune when he was recording a classical piece. I was present and could not believe it when he said ...the second trumpet on row 4 is out of tune ! ) asked me to bring an Everly Brothers LP to our next session. He just wanted to listen how they had recorded in the past. A few days later I showed up with an album, wish I could remember which one it was! We were going through some songs and he looked at me and said: Do you know that the high voice is recorded in another studio ?? I looked at him and was stunned I hardly could believe it. It still is a miracle to me.


When, in the mid 60s, the guy who used to play bass in my band got married, I thought it might be cool if I gave him a string quartet performance as a wedding gift, so I asked composer/conductor Raúl Cosío —who was music advisor for the show we were playing in— to help me transcribe the strings in the Beatles’ “Yesterday” that was hot off the presses. Raúl —who had perfect pitch— graciously agreed and asked me to play him the record while he listened attentively. He then asked me to play it back again one more time, and proceeded to write the string trio [McCartney’s voice is like the first violin in the “quartet”] right there, in front of me, without any musical instrument at hand! He then asked me to play it back one more time and made a few corrections, and voilà I had the transcription in my hands!

Bert, I’m not questioning your interesting experience and story in the least manner but, do you think the guy you mention might have just been trying to impress?

Knowing that an instrument is off key in an ensemble [specially if they’re playing different voices of a chord or “divisi”] is as basic for a conductor/producer as is checking if a car has gas in the tank for a mechanic or smelling a foul fish for a professional chef.

On the other hand, in my own humble experience (please see note below), being able to tell that Phil recorded in a different studio than Don would be almost impossible.

I’m sure we’ve all read about professional musicians and producers wondering how many Everly Brothers there were when hearing them for the first time, or being amazed at how perfectly their “twin-like” voice colors blended.

I was under the impression that —save for obvious overdubs such as harmonizing with themselves in “solo” recordings— the brothers took pride in never recording on separate tracks, let alone different sessions or studios, even when they were already having certain frictions; so first hand info from any of you guys who might know better is totally welcome!

If one is forced to record different parts of a production in different studios, one takes great care in making sure that all variables —such as type of mic, mic placement, room color and so on— remain as constant as possible. Then, during the final mix one equalizes and adds limiters, compressors, reverb and so on to make sure the different tracks blend-in and are indistinguishable from each other.

Last but not least, knowing how hard the brothers and their teams of musicians, engineers and producers worked to get the best final product possible —by trying out different arrangements and production options, and particularly on the coordination and balance of their perfectly harmonized voices—, I find it very hard to believe they would tolerate a final mix in which anyone could tell they had recorded in different studios, if they ever did.

Note: Don’t have anything near perfect pitch, but have educated my ear over years of professionally singing, playing, arranging, conducting, recording, producing, engineering and so on. Would never dream of trying to impress anyone in this sensitive and multi-talented group [gotta be if you’re an Everly fan, right?] or “show-off” in any way —which is why I’m writing this in a separate note at the end—, just displaying my “credentials”:

Ever since my first recording experience in the very late 50s, I’ve had the privilege of working along with, for, or under some of the following personalities in the music business —besides Mr. Raúl Cosío— [more or less in chronological order], and I don’t believe any of them would be able to tell if the separate voices of any Everly Brothers song had been recorded in different studios and then mixed [I certainly don’t think I could!]: Fito de la Parra [drummer of “Canned Heat”]; Abe Laboriel Sr., in Mexico City [bassist & father of Paul McCartney’s drummer]; Val Valentin, in Mexico City recording studio [recording engineer/producer for Frank Sinatra, among many others]; Eugenio Toussaint [Mexican born composer and orchestra conductor of Paul Anka]; Billy Davis Jr., in NY City recording studio [producer, member of “The Fifth Dimension”]; Tony Bennett & his musicians, in Acapulco concert; Henry Mancini, at benefit concert in Mexico City.

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RicardoAPriori private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisW
@RicardoAPriori

The first version you posted Ricardo they call it the composite take and I have never known why, usually another take or alternate version. Both version are quite different but I like them both.


No idea!

Lots of times people who upload stuff to You Tube use terms in the most erroneous, if not downright misleading, ways. Like the guys who claim they are re-mastering songs, when in order to do so they would have to have access to the original masters of the recordings.

Then there's the bunch of silly ignorant wannabes who claim to have "enhanced" or "extended" the hard work of the original artists, musicians, producers, engineers, and so on and so forth.

Enjoy comparing the different "just guitars", "stereo horns & voices", "added chorus", etc. in the different versions though...

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DeeDee private msg quote post Address this user
Wow! really interesting stuff Ricardo! Bert has started a really interesting thread here! It is always fascinating to hear about what goes into a recording!
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Jeanroberts private msg quote post Address this user
Ah! Yes DeeDee, very interesting from bert and Ricardo!

One point stood out to me. Ricardo suggested bert's musician friend could have been showing off about hearing an out of tune instrument among sixty others and also claiming the Everly's had recorded their songs in different studios!

I'll try to be brief...... I once sat in on a recording session for a while, listening to The Bee Gee's record. I was in a listening booth, The Bee Gees in the large studio and the producer and engineers in the control room! The producer's name I can’t remember except he was American! This studio was in London!

The producer was telling Maurice Gibb to tune his guitar! Maurice replied that he had, it sounded fine to me. However the producer wasn't satisfied and every now and then repeated ‘Maurice, tune that E string! From the control room the producer is now singing loudly the E note and others!

Again came the producers voice....”Maurice! do something to that guitar!” Finally, the mild mannered Maurice had to leave the studio and go have a word with the ‘full of himself producer’

I truly felt rattled at this producer playing ‘the Mr Big Man’ to the small audience in the listening booth!

It’s a world of great opportunity and the Bee Gee's knew what they were doing. The only one showing off was this wretched producer!

I'm afraid I can’t remember the album they were working on, but seemed like it was just at the demo stage! xxx
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RicardoAPriori private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeanroberts
Ah! Yes DeeDee, very interesting from bert and Ricardo!

One point stood out to me. Ricardo suggested bert's musician friend could have been showing off about hearing an out of tune instrument among sixty others and also claiming the Everly's had recorded their songs in different studios!

I'll try to be brief...... I once sat in on a recording session for a while, listening to The Bee Gee's record. I was in a listening booth, The Bee Gees in the large studio and the producer and engineers in the control room! The producer's name I can’t remember except he was American! This studio was in London!

The producer was telling Maurice Gibb to tune his guitar! Maurice replied that he had, it sounded fine to me. However the producer wasn't satisfied and every now and then repeated ‘Maurice, tune that E string! From the control room the producer is now singing loudly the E note and others!

Again came the producers voice....”Maurice! do something to that guitar!” Finally, the mild mannered Maurice had to leave the studio and go have a word with the ‘full of himself producer’

I truly felt rattled at this producer playing ‘the Mr Big Man’ to the small audience in the listening booth!

It’s a world of great opportunity and the Bee Gee's knew what they were doing. The only one showing off was this wretched producer!

I'm afraid I can’t remember the album they were working on, but seemed like it was just at the demo stage! xxx


Yes Jean, sometimes 2nd hand producers & music execs will try to justify their pay, particularly when producing commercial "jingles".

As I mentioned above, being able to spot an out of tune instrument in an ensemble [no matter if it's a symphonic orchestra or a mariachi band] is like "conductor/producer 101", but saying anyone could tell that the usually perfect blend Don & Phil always achieved was recorded in two different studios is another thing.

Definitely don't think this would ever have been the case with, say Val Valentin, Billy Davis Jr. or Eugenio Toussaint [please see my post above for their experience]

Guess Willie & Waylon had something to say about the case ["parental advise", etc. ...]:



LOL!
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Jeanroberts private msg quote post Address this user
Wow! Ha! Ha! Ricardo, I think that song (Waylon and Willie) says it all! xxxxx
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bert private msg quote post Address this user
This producer ( studio owner) told me about two voices recorded in two different studio's long before we all knew that it all was done so 'cause Phil told us.
He did not know the Everly Brothers, never spoke to them and he was not into American music, so he could not know it , but just heard it.
From his studio came 45% (!) of the million sellers in the German "Hit Parade" in the early seventies. He was THE man to record with in those days. So just don't understand why you have a meaning about someone, you don't know.
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Jeanroberts private msg quote post Address this user
I'm sure we understand you bert! You are telling us your experiences. All stories are hugely interesting and they are answered one to another about our own thoughts and questions and what we've been privy to! We tell it like it is and discuss the situations! It certainly gives the forum plenty to ponder over!

Do hope you are still gigging with the band! Let us know how it is going and do hope your health is going from strength to strength! xxxxx
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RicardoAPriori private msg quote post Address this user
Thank you Bert, for your comment & clarification.

Totally agree with Jean’s and certainly hope mine have not been misconstrued, since they refer to my own experiences and definitely not to anyone I never met. Recapping some of them just to make sure:

« Bert, I’m not questioning your interesting experience and story in the least manner but, do you think the guy you mention might have just been trying to impress? »

Re: the brothers recording in different studios: « …first hand info from any of you guys who might know better is totally welcome! »

Until I read your comment above, I had no idea that it had been Phil who had personally told you about his overdubbing his harmony over Don’s original melody in a different studio. This is the very first notice ever of such an instance and am just dying to know what song[s] this took place in.

What immediately came to mind when hearing that someone might be able to detect when two [or more] unison or harmonizing voices were recorded in different studios after they had been post-produced were these two obvious examples:





A bit more on above examples:





Producer David Foster & engineer Al Schmitt on recording of “Unforgettable”:

« I used a Neumann U67 on her voice, along with just 2dB of a Summit limiter and a Neve 1073 preamp. […] When her father recorded 'Unforgettable', he used a 47, and the 67 matched up pretty well with that.
[…]
In terms of matching room sound, I changed the echo around a little bit […] and if I need to use a little EQ on something to bring up the high end I might do that too. »

PLEASE CLICK HERE FOR ORIGINAL ARTICLE ON RECORDING OF "UNFORGETTABLE"

Keep on rockin’ Bert!
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ChrisW private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by RicardoAPriori
I had no idea that it had been Phil who had personally told you about his overdubbing his harmony over Don’s original melody in a different studio. This is the very first notice ever of such an instance and am just dying to know what song[s] this took place in.


I have read it was songs from the album "Some Hearts". Of course it is always good to have it clarified by someone else too.

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Joyb private msg quote post Address this user
I understand Cold from Whistle Down the Wind was recorded in different places/studios xx❤️❤️
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ChrisW private msg quote post Address this user
Yes I read that too Joy. They were so good I guess it was no problem to them.
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Roxy private msg quote post Address this user
Dave Edmunds the producer on EB84 and Born Yesterday has talked in interviews about Don and Phil recording seperately even though Phil knew it didn’t sound as good. I tried to find those interviews but was unsuccessful. Personally I feel Dave Edmunds comments a trifle acerbic.
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ChrisW private msg quote post Address this user
I am not convinced about Dave Edmunds either Roxy, on EB84 there was too much 'production' on several songs.
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Liz58 private msg quote post Address this user
Just a quick addition to this thread..this was played on BBC radio Ulster today..the DJ said afterwards that he was singing along to it, and why not?
Glad to hear something that's NOT from the usual list of Bye Bye Love etc...
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Redhead1966 private msg quote post Address this user
Liz58 -

Agree 100%! People have to be told or reminded that the Everlys had so much more to offer the world than a handful of songs recorded in the 1950's.
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